[aaron_straker]: 0:26

Happy Tuesday, Gus Walkcom back to another episode of each train. Prosper. Today's episode is part two of Briry and Ies, follow up on ourspective and one practical recap. So if you haven't listened to part one yet, go back and listen to that and then today we're going to follow up with everything we didn't cover in part one on today's part two episode. Want to jump into it?

[bryan_boorstein]: 0:48

Yeah, yeah, totally. um. I also want to say that, Uh, prior to part one we had our December qn a episode and I went back and relisted to it and we actually talked a lot about Enon and Cas, and a lot of that stuff on that episode, too. So, um, one thing I, I wanted to bring to light from that episode that we talked about was Tibia angle in relation to foot platform on a back supported movement. So we're thinking about like a hack, squaw a leg press or a pendulum squa, or something Along those lines, Right, and one of the things that that we were discussing the lastppos, I made reference to my uh, my hack press at home, and how I created this amazing setup where I can use these heel wedges and put them super down low and put my feet close together and I'm getting this most ridiculous neneeflection And then you kind of said this thing that, Um, it doesn't exactly matter how much neflection you get when your back is. Supported is that correct?

[aaron_straker]: 1:51

That's the kind of takeaway I got from it, but I should have alluded on that episode. I think this is what Kath told me, but I, I'm not convicted because

[bryan_boorstein]: 2:00

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 2:01

it still kind of liket ineriy. Does it? does it? not? so I'm interested to hear your follow period because maybe I just listened like a dumb ass

[bryan_boorstein]: 2:11

No, for sure, for sure. So so I'm not a hundred percent short either, but I can use two pieces of information and I think that we can kind of intu it a a result of this right. Oh, one thing for sure, is that the pendulum is a little bit different than a hack because you're pushing away from it in an arc. Um, So, and I think your question that you reference was about a guy on the pendulum? right,

[aaron_straker]: 2:39

specific to the pendulum. Yeah,

[bryan_boorstein]: 2:41

Yeah, so I think that that's one potential caveat. Um, and the reason that I think that that's important is because in the final day we had the semi programming lecture that he went about where you talking about exercise selection And did he have those like things where we know the top of the board had quads and the bottom had hands. And then there was a doctors on one side and glues on the other, and like you would choose movements that would fit somewhere in the spectrum.

[aaron_straker]: 3:06

Yes, we did it from a. We did it with like chests. I think. actually, but

[bryan_boorstein]: 3:09

Okay,

[aaron_straker]: 3:09

yeah, same exercise.

[bryan_boorstein]: 3:11

yeah, yeah, so we did it for for legs. Um, and so as we were going through these a couple of times he was like, Is this going to be more quads than this one, or is this one more quad than that one or whatever? And so everyone would kind of be, Or I mostly was the only one talking. I would give my opinion, Then he'd be like anyone else. Think Ran's right, you know, and like no one would raise their hands. So Um, so he'd be like, All right. We're going on the floor. We're going to test this.

[aaron_straker]: 3:35

I have a question for you.

[bryan_boorstein]: 3:36

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 3:36

Did you guys have to like you know at? were we able to do it at the beginning of each day at the end of each day like you'd like Okay, you stand up. Show me like the lengthened. you know, um, position of like the shorthead of the bicepts or whatever do you guys do? That? Was it like? incredibly, just like

[bryan_boorstein]: 3:48

yeah, yeah, yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 3:51

overwhelming, And did you like? I fucked it up horribly every single time, Like when other people would go, I would be able to find it and like Okay, That makes sense. That makes sense. And then for some reason like when I was on the spot, my brain would just like shut off like the the one I got on like uh day two was like the most basic one. He was like Okay, Like the the medial Ha, sorry, the lateral head of the delt, you know, shortened, which is literally just like arms out at a tea Like basic. Yeah, literally the most basic it is And I'm like Okay

[bryan_boorstein]: 4:17

right. The top of the latterways and the scapular plane. Yeah, yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 4:22

later and I am like doing some re delt thing on the inside and then like no, Fck. And then when I realize that I' mo, I literally got teed up the easiest one and fucked it up so bad.

[bryan_boorstein]: 4:36

yeah, there was a girl, uh, who sat in front of me who would get like so nervous all the time that you would like see her. almost like shaking in her chair, because she waser so nervous. and uh, and she just turned me to be like. I'm not okay, you know, but uh, but no, I. I, so I fucked up all of them on the arm in Delt day because A, it was day one. I didn't understand anything and I was. I was doing the same thing like when he would be like, like the one I got in that day that I really remember is he was like a long head of the biep lengthened and and so in my mind I'm like like, Of course, in retrospect, that's in the bottom of an inclined Dubell curl, like, or an inclined cable croww with your elbow in and externally rotated right, That's the bottom of the length and position like I knew that intuitively, but in my head I'm like Okay, look, do, sh my arm this way, blah blah. Blah, you know, and like, and of course you, just in the moment you know, you do get a little bit flustered, but um, I think I. I. I redeemed myself on the subsequent days.

[aaron_straker]: 5:37

Yeah,

[bryan_boorstein]: 5:38

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 5:38

the arm one in the hard, the glue one is really hard too for me. andcause

[bryan_boorstein]: 5:44

yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 5:44

I just don't care like I walk

[bryan_boorstein]: 5:45

yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 5:46

up a hill and I get a massive fucking glue pump. So it those things like a compartmentalizeed, because I I

[bryan_boorstein]: 5:51

yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 5:52

don't need to know as much as I need to know these other things.

[bryan_boorstein]: 5:55

gotcha. Yeah, I think I did pretty. I'm pretty. I think what you need to know about the gluees is that the the max, the mead, and the men, they kind of go out laterally right, and um, as long as you know that the glue max is going to be things where you're mostly in the Sagal plane, And then as you move out laterally you go to the glue, Mead, and then the glue in. Like, I'm not super concerned about whether I know the different regions of the glue, Max. you know, I'm kind of just like it's the glue. Max. Like I all, it'll get trained. Um. so so yeah, but anyway, talk about the the pendulum and the tibia angle and all that stuff. Um. So so a, the pendulum pushes back in an arc, so I think in that sense it doesn't fully matter about the the shin angle at the front side, Um. because you are pushing forward against the platform, which is quadbias in general, Um. But as we were going through that programming chart and kind of being like, Is this more quad biased or is that more quad biased? we went out to the floor and started testing stuff, and Cas goes okay, So if I put my feet here on a hack, squat and a leg press, he did both, Um and I go down. You know it. it's g. It is for sure, quad and uh, you know there's a little bit of glue or whatever, and then he was like What if I do this and I put my feet in a sissy position and he literally put his feet like as low as they could go on the leg press so that he had to roll into his toes at the uh, at the fully lengthened position. And uh, and he was like, that's obviously more quad. And so the only thing that would make that obviously more quad would be that it's changing the Tivia angle and pushing it forward more over the toes. Because he moved his feet down, and uh and went on to his toes there. So I, I think that there is some relevance to shin angle to to platform, Um. The other kind of C thing that I should mention is that a couple of times he said things like it's not more quad. it's just less glute. And so he and I, That wasn't in specific reference to the thing I'm talking about, but he said it enough times that when I think about that, that's one of the things that pops into my head of like, maybe like something like that is not in fact more quad. It's a just less cllue, but therefore it makes it more quat bias, Because that was the drill that we were doing Was that you know, Is it more quad byas, There is it more Gbiased. It makes it more quadbiased, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's more quad. um. so as a programming consideration that becomes like okay, Do I want to do like the sledge hammer version where I get the G loots and the quads together and I get just as much quad. but I also get a little bit of glute. Or maybe I don't want to train my gluts in the lengthen position to today. Maybe I want to train them in the shortened position, so I'll do this sissy squat version of my hack press. But then I'll throw in like a gloop bridge or a forty five hip extension or something like that

[aaron_straker]: 8:44

Yeah, I mean those are. those are like the big. Those are like the long standing, kind of takeaway things of understanding that difference, moving you know, kind of going back to to that original question or what I brought up, You know, two episodes. Ag. Is it I think when in you alluded to this? I think the angle of the pendulum does change it, because it's like the arcing motion, so you're going to achieve that anyway. But yes, in like a le press, a hack squad or something like that, you do want to achieve that Shi angle because you' not using that mean ninety nine percent of machines aren't going to have that arching motion. So

[bryan_boorstein]: 9:22

Right exactly

[aaron_straker]: 9:22

like that, that glue press and the pendulum are the only two that I can think of. There's also

[bryan_boorstein]: 9:25

yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 9:26

like a swing hack thing I've seen as well, but very rare.

[bryan_boorstein]: 9:31

let's talk real quick. just about that, a miserable single egg glu machine Because that was the worst thing I did the whole weekend was what Cass put me through on that thing. Um, like everyone talked about the leg day being so bad on Sunday, but that one set of single egg glue press on that pendulum glue thing was so essentially cast. thought that I chose away. those two light is is the real result of the thing because Uh, he pushed against me for five reps and then on the sixth he tried to let me do it myself, but he had gasped me so hard from the first five that I could no longer get the sixth rarap. So then he had to help me for five raps, be cause. he said You're getting ten, no matter what. So so literally like I'm sitting there on the sixth threat, pushing and nothing's moving and I'm like I need help. And then from there I had to do four more reps so that for sure was just the most debilitating experience of my life, and I've had a number. I mean, not of my life. That's not sure at all, but I've had. I've had a number of people contact me and be like, Dude. You're going past failure on everything for four straight days. What is the point of all of this? So so I will ask you, because I have my thoughts on it as well. But why do you think that you know? Because their their programming philosophy is not to push you past failure all the time. Their programming philosophy is not even know. Usually, it's you know, a set to failure on each exercise. Maybe something along those lines very generally, but they' are not using forc raraps and partials all the time. Like. so so what do you think is kind of the idea behind the way that this is done at camp

[aaron_straker]: 11:06

twofold part one. It is absolutely fantastic marketing material. Um. second part, I firmly believe a lot of people do not know what true failure really is and be, especially in this day and age were like the evidence based. You know Um movement. I guess I could say is becoming so prominent in Like not going to fail your repts in reserve, Like people will stop at a like a two r i r. That's probably like a six r i r. And if we're using the effective reps, you know Um model, you kind of wasted that set. Es. Essentially, if your goal is hypertrophy and really to just help you know you see. hey, this is what failure is type of thing. So that part and I should have said three because I just thought of a third one. Another part that was was really interesting is as much as you go there to learn how to move yourself, you go there to learn how to be a better coach, and part of that is like guiding someone towards that technical failure and making sure that you are spotting them appropriately, not just yanking the weight as they are close to failure, but giving them just half a per cent of assistance when they only need half a per cent. And then maybe that goes up to one per cent just to help them, you know, still utilize as much as they really can like. Maybe that is like a a true failure. And then you're giving them that just one percent. They need to really get an incredible stimulus out of that. You know, Um set. So I think you know there's there's threefold right. If to be completely honest, like if we went there and we were just doing like, you know, movement under light load, and like practicing raps like it, it doesn't have as much. It's It's honestly not as fun for me, I, I'm really happy I got to go there and swing for the fences with A with a group of guys that I just met And it was it was fun. You know, it brought me back to like my high school football days in the We room, just fucking slinging weight with friends and trying as hard as you possibly could. I definitely feel there is a a large benefit to that just in terms of like a a social aspect.

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:09

Uhhuh? Yeah, the camaraderie side this is true. I actually also like the point about the marketing. That's a pretty obvious one that wasn't like on the front of my brain. Um, but yeah, for sure, you see people dying on a hack swaat with fourestfts and like the, the, the inner uh, massacus inside of us is like Yeah, sign me up for that. Um, but uh, but yeah, so my idea was kind of the moral on the lines of like people don't really know how to train hard. And and I think that that really is kind of seen in the evidence space crowd now where there people are, like I trained to two r, Ir. But they're really at like six or something and I have no idea. Um, say yeah, that's a super solid point. Um. so yeah, what do we have on the agenda today?

[aaron_straker]: 13:53

So first, uh, the the biggest part that we're going to talk about is mostly like. What is the impact of of this experience in? I, sorry, What is like the education and and impact of this on our are. basically, you know, cminal of experience and how does that change going forward? Like how is this? Let's first talk about ourselves, Brian. Like,

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:09

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 14:10

how is this experience going to change how you train yourself moving forward?

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:15

good question and I went back uh yesterday and reviewed the hypertphy cycle that I kind of laid out. Was it what? two or three episodes ago now, Uh that I was planning on implementing after I got done with the N one? and uh, honestly, I went through it and I changed out maybe three movements, but the general structure of the entire Uh cycle remained the same Like I exchanged out. You know, Uh, one type of row for a different type of row like I'mnna I really want to do one of those one arm Ros and the functional trainer that we talked about on the last episode. Um, so I wanted to put one of those in and I wanted to. I had a just a cvicular press around in, but I wanted to put a coststal press around in too, because it. I originally had a a double arm coststal, Uh press. But it's just it's not very loadable, like at some point you reach a point where the wait just starts pulling you up, or you have to compromise stability and positioning to to get the weight in the position, so doing them one arm like was, I did those at N one. And and they were fantastic, so I'm going to do the majority of my chess work with press rounds, which is actually funny, 'cause that was the the point we made on the last episode was. It's not like we're going to just start doing press aroundunds now, Um, but actually like that. Uh, that is I am. I'm going to be doing a cvicular press around, a uh, a costal press around. and then I'm going to be doing a uh. I think a flat dumbbell press. So

[aaron_straker]: 15:38

That'. The exact thought that I had like to tell like is exactly how I'm going to structure mind, Mhm, Yp,

[bryan_boorstein]: 15:43

really that's Aso. Yeah, so I think I'm goingnna, I'm going to do that. Um, I changed out a row like I said, I, uh, didn't change anything in the structure of my lower body work. Um, even given that, it's like a hamstring biased cycle. Um, so to speak, but the the thing that I did get the most that I think I'm going to be implementing over time is kind of some different ideas and ways that we discussed to bias the lengthened position, And this is a topic that you and I talk about constantly for six months. twelve months. Maybe since we even started the podcast. Uh, we've we've been talking about the importance of length position and we've had all those studies come out and all that stuff. So I asked Cas a number of questions about this, Um, and I think that it would be kinda cool to talk to listeners about some of the different ways that we can do that. So Ah, what I have been doing for the last year plus has been to take a set of a short overload movement so you can think of any type of row or pull down movement. A like extension, like curl type thing. I've been essentially taking those two concentric failure where I cannot complete a full rep any morere, and then I've been completing three to six partial reps where I'm trying to complete a full rap, but I'm unable to write. And so this provides a certain amount of of tension into the lengthened position, which, if you just stopped when you could no longer do the full rep than you have all of that range on the other side of the movement. That you're kind of just leaving less trained. so to speak, So I asked Cass about like you know, what would be like some other ways that we could work to bias the

[aaron_straker]: 17:28

Ss,

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:28

length in position, Um, because in my head intuitively it was like. Is the length in position really getting taxed fully if you're only doing it lengthened because the short position is already too tired. Right, because then you've kind of even tired out the length position like, Yes, you're exerting Max's effort. Um. But what I later realized is that this approach of doing the partials is more of like a metabolic impact on the muscle, so it's creating more metabolites in into it. Et cetera Right. There's another approach that I would call probably like the sledge hammer approach, to really like mash the length in position. And so this is kind of like what many people might refer to as a reverse drop set. And for all of the years of my training, twenty five years now I have never in my life try to reverse dropse. So essentially what this means is that you would take a short overloaded movement will use a a row, and you'll go until a couple rep shy, a few reptsiy, maybe two to four, two to four ep. shy of being able to complete a full rep. So you're leaving yourself still like a little bit fresh, Um, with the short position, so you haven't completely taxed all the the short position pieces, And then you increase the weight twenty five percent. So let's assume you were rowing with a hundred pounds. You would go to two to four reps, Shi. a failure. you would increase your weight to a hundred and twenty five pounds, and you would complete as many reps as you could, Pulling as far as you can. there would obviously have to be like a cut off point like once I can. No longer complete a quarter of a wrap or a third of a wraper, or whatever it is you, you would you would cut the set. Um. but the idea is more or less that however many reps you got on the short position, Uh, where you stopped tut a four up shire failure. you should get something similar as you're going through these heavier lengthened position reps, and Um. That's something that I think is universally

[aaron_straker]: 19:21

S.

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:22

applicable across all short overload movements. I mean, I wouldn't program it for all of them at the same time. I think you're asking for a lot of damage and stuff like that, but I think that the idea the concept could be applied to all of these movements, and uh specifically as it relates to hams strings, and Sp, even more specifically to the hip extension machine or hip extension in general. Um. This is a cool idea because it's always going to fail at the short position And I asked In the past, you know what would be the best way to bias the length in position, And the answer was just do the three quarters of the range of motion. Like Don't actually do the shortened position at all. or uh, He had another idea. That was, actually, I'll go over the other ideas in the second, but basically in the hip extension. That would work really well, too, because once again it's a short overload movement where you can't essentially overload the length position unless I do something like go like fifty pound dumbbells until I can't achieve short anymore, or two to four upp, shy. and then I can jump up to like the seventy fives or something like that and just do like the bottom range of motion and I can just imagine how uh, how much stimulus that would be for the hams strings in that position.

[aaron_straker]: 20:30

Yeah, that that is such. That is such a perfect use case of that exercise for that that reverse drop set that is really really cool. You were. We were briefly, uh, corresponding about that on Intram and I understood it. you know, in theory, but I now I fully get it from how you just explained it here. That's great, especially for things like Rose or something like that where you're never really training that overload to like a. A true. you know failure because the shorten is always going to take so much of that.

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:02

Yeah, yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 21:02

That's that's brilliant. That's really really cool.

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:04

I I think so, too. Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 21:05

Yeah,

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:05

so he gave me a number of different ways that we can biyas, the lengthen position in short overload movements. Saw. I'll cover those real quick. but that was the one that stood out to me as like the most profound and the one that I think is going to stick with me the most. So uh, other ways are. uh, like I said, avoiding the top of the range of motion from the beginning. I'm not a huge fan of that approach, though, like I don't know, I'd rather do the reverse drops set than just like Start by doing partial reps.

[aaron_straker]: 21:30

agreed.

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:30

Um, and then uh, he said, Another option is one and a quarter or one and a half reps. So you would do like a full hip extension and then you would do just a bottom portion wrap, and then a full hip extension and then just a bottom portion. Upp. Um, he also proposed the idea of pre exhaust, which is something that I actually have written into my program. Currently where, on the hip extension day I have it scheduled to go from uh leg curlled directly to hip extension. Um. So in that sense I should get some some solid pre fatigue, and then one of the kind of stipulations of preexhaust supers setts was that the second movement has to be stable, so you wouldn't want to go from like a a uh, a leg curl to an arty l. even though I've done that before, I think that that's probably a worse idea than going from the light girl to the um to the hip extension. Just because in the ay all there' so many more ways to compensate, I mean, maybe the the better example of that is if you went from a leg extension to a Ba, squat, like you could have all the best intentions in the world of like. I'm going to stay in my quads and make this like a really quad dominant squat. But but once you do the leg extension and then you start squatting, your body's naturally just going to become more hip dominant Because your quads are going to be roasted. Um, so I think you know it still stabilization in the second exercise was one of the other Um takeaways I got from kind of supers setting same muscle groups. And uh so if I'm going to use a less stable movement, I would do that first and then do the leg extension of the leg C second, Um to a kind of achieve a similar fact like a post exhaust sequence.

[aaron_straker]: 23:01

yeah, yeah, that that makes perfect sense to me.

[bryan_boorstein]: 23:04

Yeah, but that uh, length and overload stuff like how to bias. That's that is going to be a huge portion of just things that I experiment with in training like. I'm definitely not even at a point where I'm going to program that for a client where I'm like No dude. we're goingnna totally do these like bottom length things heavier than your actual prior set. Like No, I'm not going to program that until I have a Ch. Psychotic experiment with it for a couple of months. But, um, it's definitely like, like you kind of alluded to, or even said directly that at this point in our training career, just having like new tools to play with is super cool because it really does get to the point where doing the same things and reading the same materials like it kind of reaches the point like I was even talking with Mccoonney about this, where like last year we were saying that there's just no new information in training, like how many new training studies come out, or new training ideas or methodogies where you're like. Wow, that really like could potentially be something that I'm interested in implementing into my training. Most of the stuff we've already been trying for twenty years. and so there isn't a lot of new novel stuff that we really want to implement And this fits the bill of something that you know, pequs my interest and gets me really excited.

[aaron_straker]: 24:11

I agree and you just just spark something that I forgot. I asked Casi. especially with some of these things like you said were talking with with Dave Mcney and so much of the evidence spaced stuff. So something that we've talked about. You know at length on this podcast before is the the studies about shortened, uh, are started seated leg extensions Versus like the prone lying leg extension. So I asked Cass about this and he gave me like a A. As always, just a fantastic answer and he was like Well, it depends like, maybe um, like, let's say on a on a day where you have a lot of um lengthened overload movements on your hampshs, Like let' say're doing heavy ri ls, or something like that. It can make sense to then do the prone lying le girl, because it's going to overload that shortened position so much more. And then maybe you have like a quad dominant um leg day and you're not doing that much other hamsterring. It would be great to then use the seated leg curl and like it's just the context straight. And and that's what's I mean. I'm I'm not going to sit here and bash. you know, research studies by any degree. But if they do not exist in the context of the exact application you want to use them for there is some degree of limited applicability. and I think again, its. it sounds really corny. But it's such a fantastic name for how Cass is branded as company is and one, because like every answer really is like, it depends right Like have people are like. Different situations have an end of one, depending on you know the context of the situation and how you might handle things is is different depending upon that specific context, And I thought

[bryan_boorstein]: 25:50

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 25:51

that was like brilliant, re. habccause.

[bryan_boorstein]: 25:52

no, that's that really well said. Yeah.

[aaron_straker]: 25:54

No,

[bryan_boorstein]: 25:54

He actually said the same thing to us in the same contact with the La girl, And then, because I only have a seaated likel If you only have one which which you want you know and is like

[aaron_straker]: 26:08

Okay, and I was interested. and it was I. I know he said not like. Obviously there's a They. They still have a lot of equipment coming into their H. q, but I knowic that there wasn't a seated light C. there was only the the lying. One, um, and that could have be literally just equipment availability and

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:22

they'll have a seated one. The

[aaron_straker]: 26:22

shipping, and all sorts. of. Yeah, I figured that, but I just thought that's what reminded me of it because there was only the line you know

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:28

yeah, yeah, yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 26:29

when I was there, but

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:31

no, I hadn't done a lying like girl. The last time I did one was with you in Uh, in Austin, So so getting on that on that machine again, there to do the Cas set was was cool and I actually like. I really do enjoy the lying. like girl. I. it. it's different for sure. Um, it's almost easier like I think, being that you're laying down like you're prone and you really only have to focus on one thing. I mean, not that you have to focus on multiple things, be cause you're sitting, but like, but, but the leverage isn't as good in the seated, like girl. you know, like your, your legs are extended, so the moment arm is longer.

[aaron_straker]: 27:05

mhm,

[bryan_boorstein]: 27:06

Um, whereas be cause you more of your legs are extended in that one, whereas in the sea in the lying one, only your tibia is extended and your quads are are pressed anyway.

[aaron_straker]: 27:15

mhm, Mhm,

[bryan_boorstein]: 27:15

So for whatever reason, um, I, I enjoyed it. I could see myself doing more of those if I had the option.

[aaron_straker]: 27:21

That. And that's exactly what I did when on my first leg day back, and and specifically what I did was I set the movement up so that I would remove a lot of that gastrock at the at the first, like fifteen degree and I had like incredible hamsterring

[bryan_boorstein]: 27:31

Uhhuh, the first fifteen degrees. Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 27:36

attraction from it

[bryan_boorstein]: 27:36

nice,

[aaron_straker]: 27:37

like it's it comes back to like knowing is really, it can be like half the battle in a lot

[bryan_boorstein]: 27:42

Mhm,

[aaron_straker]: 27:43

of these things like because you know, like, like, like anyone you, it's hard to not to, to intentionally not use the momentum.

[bryan_boorstein]: 27:49

yep,

[aaron_straker]: 27:50

And when I just removed, you know, I set it instead of like completely, you know hundred. Not that wouldn't be a hundred eight degrees. I, and instead of being like fully open, I closed the chain a little bit so that I, you know, finished the movement. When my knee was still

[bryan_boorstein]: 28:03

uhhuh,

[aaron_straker]: 28:03

somewhat bent, and just the the hamstring. You know, stemiless. I got out of it was so much more.

[bryan_boorstein]: 28:07

Yep.

[aaron_straker]: 28:08

I think I only did two sets and I was

[bryan_boorstein]: 28:09

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 28:09

like Fck, Dude, I'm done. I'm moving on.

[bryan_boorstein]: 28:11

well, Anne, like you're not even getting the stretch position, so theoretically you probably could do more sets. So you just got like a little disrupted by all the metabolites or whatever, But I think over time you'll be able to do more of those that way,

[aaron_straker]: 28:20

Yeah,

[bryan_boorstein]: 28:21

Um, one of the other things kind of relevant to that. that. Uh, that that cast kind of was big on, and he made me do this as well On one of the exercises is the idea of a mechanical drops set. So a great example of that would be like Dumbbell fly till you can't do any more, and then dumbbell fly, press until you can't do any more than Dumb bell bench until you can't do anymore, Because essentially your, your mechanical advantage is increasing as your as your arms move in, and so you can continue a accruing reps or whatever. And so this, the leg C idea is is what sparked that in my brain, Because that was one of Cass's examples. as he's like. What you could do is you could just do like more isolated like curls, where you uh, don't do the fifteen degrees until failure and then you could start doing full reps where you ask the calf for help in the beginning. and now you can get like three or five more reps by going a little bit more range of motion, which is an interesting uh. Example of of more range of motion being easier than less range of motion Because that's not always the case, And another example of that, and this is the one that he made me do is he made me fucking take cast glue bridges to failure. and then right when I thought I was done, he goes. Now, do hip thrusts until you can't do any more. And so so I'm like doing this like super acute, like small range of motion for the For the glue bridge, Right and then he's like hip thrust now and like the bottom position flies up, and then you get to the top and it's like B, you know becausecause like you're still like super fucked up in the short position, But now you have all this power coming from the length and position, Um, so that sort of thing can be applied to movements where it's relevant as well,

[aaron_straker]: 30:04

yeah, yeah. So one of the the from that thought of it is really interesting because it takes we're having this conversation, Ra, and we're taking something that's somewhat like I don't know. I. The word that comes to mind is a brutish in nature, and like historically, like lifting weights. and just oh, you know, big guys, you know. somewhat dumb. Historically, we're just going to go lift weights. Now it's like, in order to get better at that, we need to become like intellectuals and understand like mechanics

[bryan_boorstein]: 30:32

philosophers.

[aaron_straker]: 30:32

and human, and that, Yeah, and like. Oh, well, if I, I know, if the you know, the first fifteen degrees of um kneeflection is is the gash rock. And if I

[bryan_boorstein]: 30:40

Right,

[aaron_straker]: 30:41

remove that by starting the movement, there can buy us more hamstring And then when I open it up, I can, you know, and it's just kind of funny where it's like. In order to get really really good, you need to go back to the complete opposite of what probably

[bryan_boorstein]: 30:51

yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 30:52

drew you to this in the beginning and start thinking about it and understanding it more. just kind of funny.

[bryan_boorstein]: 30:57

yeah, I know for sure. I love that there was actually a on one of the Iron Culture episodes. Um, they had a a culture historian on like a weightlifting culture historian. It was really interesting. and uh. And he was saying that, like you know, the, the, the idea of the stereotypical meathead who isn't smart, there was actually a scientist in like the forties or fifties that went out to test this because he was convinced that people that lifted weights were stupid, and so he started giving I q tests to to all the weightlifters and the average aggregate of all of their scores was above average, And so he essentially spent the next like twenty years trying to dispprove his prior bias, So like it's just so funny how how that that goes like. That you know,

[aaron_straker]: 31:42

Yeah, yeah,

[bryan_boorstein]: 31:44

Um, okay, what do? What else do you have? As far as uh, anything for yourself, Things that you want to implement.

[aaron_straker]: 31:50

no,

[bryan_boorstein]: 31:52

How about in in programming of others? I know you don't do as much programming of others as I do. But do you think there's any kind of overriding conceptual pieces or specific pieces that that kind of will influence your programming?

[aaron_straker]: 32:06

definitely definitely so in terms of and I briefly alluded to this in the in the previous episode, but like the the amount of short and overload movements versus length and overload

[bryan_boorstein]: 32:16

Yep,

[aaron_straker]: 32:16

movements specifically, because like any programming that I'm going to write is going to be purely for the goal of Hi, pertrophy. Um, If someone comes and me like A and I want to get strong, Can you help me? I'm like. Yeah, what we're going to do is I'm going to feed you and then kick. We're going to give someone else your your're training right. I'm not doing that like like it's just it's not my will else. I don't want it to be my whehouse. We'd be doing you a disservice type of thing. Um, So with that like I said, like just biasing more of the the, The, lengthened uh, overload stuff specifically for high pertury, and then within certain contacts right If if we are going to do like, Um, like you, just kind of talked about. like, Let's say we have like a garage gym program. work on a right and someone only has forty minutes. We're going to do some more of that like mechanical super set type stuff, to really get as much A as we can out of that time and just create as much stimulus as possible. So just thinking about programming from a different angle instead of thinking like you know, program specific, come down to like. Okay, What is it? Goal obvious? Ao is always havety, Um, How much time do we have? What equipment do we have? This is how we achieve that within that, so that is where I'm definitely going to start. What about you,

[bryan_boorstein]: 33:25

I'm not really sure. To be honest. I think the most prudent move is to probably start programming like a few of the Uh arcs of motion into people's training. and not even I don't think that there's a huge education piece where I need to like, look over their shoulder and be like No, You're not performing this correctly. Because I think ultimately that there is. there's different levels to the implementation of these movements right. and like I think it was is one. one of the guys that went to the seminar prior had a poster. Hes like it's not bolsy or bust, and I think that's a line from Uh from Cas as well. Where like the idea that you're that you're aware that the fact that you're aware that these things exist and the fact that your intent is to move in a better manner a more biomechanically correct manner. These intents are going to begin to teach your body, Uh, to move properly, and then as a coach I can kind of generally guide them into that. Um. but I have already been programming a bunch of nuance into my programs for advanced athletes. Um. I think you know, sprinkling in little doses of this is important. Um. Exercise selection and exercise execution are go to be the main facets that I that I focus on with the advanced people, and this course

[aaron_straker]: 34:56

Sss.

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:57

gave me the tools to be able to better analyze and manipulate people set up in movement. So it's not something as specific as I'm going to change my programming style around these new things that I know, but more about how I can gradually move people to move better and be more aware of the impact of their movement. Um, so that's kind of like one overriding precedent. I'm like more of a philosophical look at things, Um, as far as like specific pieces, Um, so like I have an advanced guy right now that I'm giving partials to, because that's what I'm comfortable programming. Now If I try these reverse dropset things and they are effective, then I can strategically program them in for him. I mean, I probably won't give them a sledgehammer and weak one of a cycle. But if we're in week five and we know we're going to deload the next week and we've been doing partials, anyways, then maybe it's you know this week we're not going to do the partials. We're going to do one of these reverse dropses and see how that goes as we had into Deload week. Um, So I think the gradual implementation of these things is important, Um, also as a way of making sure that you can uh, take the data that you get and actually make sense of it. You know, if you just kind of gave him like all the things at once, then you're like Whoa. What actually had an impact here? You know, so I think one or two things at a time is important. Um, I think I picked up a lot of just general overriding ideas on how to implement specialization cycles for people, Um. Some prior to this, given all the focus I put on myself in the hamssterring cycle that I built, but then also the knowledge that I gained there, and the different tools that are available to work with to pre to create specialization. Um, Like, Potentially, you know biasing more lengthened movements on one day, and you know if if recovery is an issue then you recover four or five days. Maybe you do a day of short overload movements where there's less damage and being able to use the tools that you have at your disposal or even like cast. You know volume ramping, like. I never thought to use volume ramping in a specialization cycle. But you take one muscle group and you increase the volume on it, but leave everything else the same And then you can kind of easily determine where you're Where's your M. r v, right? Where it is your maximum recoverable volume. How high can I push this muscle group before it just no longer recovers any morere? Um, so things like that, I think the thing I'm really struggling with is I get so many people now from my general programs that have written me and been like, Hey, How much of this are you go to incorporate into Like Paragon or into evolve? They're like this is really cool Like I want to do this, too. You know all this stuff, and the thing is that when i, when i, what I really believe is that it isn't important for my general programs, Like if you are on a general program, you may be an advanced athlete like there's nothing wrong with being on a general program and being an advanced athlete. But I can't be writing my general programs with assuming that everybody on that program has advanced, or that everybody potentially even has the same tolerance to different, like volumes and stimuli. So what I'm trying to do in creating my general programs is create a program that's the most likely to succeed for the most people, and as soon as I start incorporating a lot of this, um, really nuanceant const contextual stuff, I'm essentially going to have to make assumptions about my audience and be like my audience can benefit from doing these pol arounds or these press arounds, or, but they probably can't like to be honest. Like if I was a general person on my program, I would hate to have all of my back and chest work programmed with single armed stuff, because it's not time efficient. It's a waste of time. You have to belong to a a commercial gym. like all these different face setts, right. So, so these are tools and things that I've learned that I think more broadly apply to my training, which can then potentially be passed down to the training of my one on one clients. And if there are any broad spanning ideas from those two experiments that then I think could be relevant for the masses in general than. maybe small bits and pieces of that get sprinkled into general programs. But Um, overall, I don't think we're going to see a whole lot of change in those programs.

[aaron_straker]: 39:23

I don't think you could have explained that any better. To be

[bryan_boorstein]: 39:26

Thank you.

[aaron_straker]: 39:27

completely honest. That was very very.

[bryan_boorstein]: 39:31

cool. That's awesome. Well, I guess that leads pretty well into our. uh, our final topic, which is really like. How much does this all matter? And it kind of like it. My, my tone in talking about the general programs probably gives away my stance on it. like, like I don't. I don't think it matters until Y. it it does matter. I mean the last two percent right. So so I think even for the last two percent it might not matter, but I think for the first ninety eight percent of your journey it really doesn't matter. What do you think?

[aaron_straker]: 40:04

I don't know. and

[bryan_boorstein]: 40:05

Yeah? Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 40:05

that's being that's being completely honest. The few parts I do feel strongly where it can and I think it will really matter injury prevention

[bryan_boorstein]: 40:16

Yep, that was where I was going to go with that too. Yup.

[aaron_straker]: 40:16

right. So like just by understanding that mean and this is coming from someone whos had you know, and the Kiilles repaired a patello repaired like tenden. is reattached just from doing things wrong and being young and dumb and just literally ego lifting and that sort of things and just getting caught into. You know, um, um, dogmatic things like, Oh, if you're not a man, unless you like Barbll, back, squat and type of thing is, and then doing that for six years and I'm like, why aren't my fucking legs growing well, Er, you, you don't squat well for your quads and if you went to something you know you would learn that type of thing, but I just never did, so I think in those contexts it can really matter what is your goal right, if your goal is hy, hypertrophy, and you want a fat setta of quads and. You have long femers. You probably don't need to be doing a barbll back Squ. That's a really good context of where you know. Might this matter? Is it going to you know if if if in when I transition to becoming this, you know much more important in my training is that going to put another five pounds of muscle on me? I don't know. you know. I. I. I can't honestly give a definitive yes or no answer. I'm being honest and saying I don't know. So Brian, What do you think?

[bryan_boorstein]: 41:38

Yeah, so injury prevention is going to be the number one that I was going to talk about because that applies to everybody. I guess, including that first ninety eight percent. But I think that the problem with trying to use these methods with the first call it ninety percent cause, I think there probably be value in the ninety to a hundred percent range. But the the problem with using the methods in the first ninety percent is that it's extremely time consuming and that person probably doesn't even have the investment into this yet to warrant that much nuance in their training when they could get up to ninety percent and probably remain injury free. Sticking two basic compound movements to train multiples groups, committing less time all these different things when it does come to the injury preventions of things, though, I mean it makes a huge difference. like, like every single set that we did at N one over the weekend, four days of training seven sessions. Probably a thousand sets overall. Now hundreds, hundreds of sets. Um, there was never a concern

[aaron_straker]: 42:42

Ss.

[bryan_boorstein]: 42:43

at all that I was going to get injured because I was putting myself in the right positions and all these stuffs are like passst failure, too. so they're like past failure sets. But because my body's in the right position and I'm not compensating Um, it it does. It does make a huge difference. The fact that we're lining movements up with the muscle fibre and then using the scapula to work around. Um, that's huge. like it. really. It really really does make a difference, like your first example from the prior episode about the lateral rays, just as as simple as not going directly lateral, because oh shit, there's a bony process in your shoulder that stops your arm from going up. Like when you get to right here now you're essentially just lifting your trap to your to create. you're doing scalpular elevation to create more rise. Um. Whereas if you just move into the scalpular plane, and now I have all of this range here and you can actually feel where the stopping point is, 'cause if I continue going higher, Roop, you can see my scalpula does the same thing that it does If I'm out to the side and try to go higher, So you can you can use your body and your scalpula to find the ranges of motion that feel good for you. And what's really cool about that is, it's not that you're sacrificing results by training in a more comfortable manner. You're actually optimizing results because you're you're lining up with the muscle fibers with the joint structure, which is, Oh my god, crazy right. Like, like, why should we not have to feel pain in our joints when we're working out? Um, And so, even like my example of going through a seven weeks strength phase where I was back to doing barbe basic movements and putting my bodies in in positions that are restricted. Like I almost never use a barbell anymore in my training because I don't don't like being in that forward pronated position. I'd much rather have my hands attached to something neutral and be able to move Um from that plane of motion. So um, so I think in that sense it it does matter and I think it increases longevity. I think that that becomes even more important as we get older. Um, So yeah, I mean that that would be my thought. I. There're still like, like, even even me in in these last two percent, like I, If you would have asked me a year ago, I probably would have said like Yeah, you know once I'm done trying to make gains and I'm just going to in maintenance like I'm probably just going to, you know, go back to like the six basic movements and just do those. But now I don't. I don't feel that way, because those movements don't feel good for me. Um, so when I want to go to maintenance now, I'm probably going to use even more cables than I use now. and to be honest, my training probably isn't going to change a lot from it is now. I'm just going to do less of it. Um, whereas in the past I would have thought that I would have just gone back to these basic movements and now I realize that those basic movements don't feel good for me, and that there is a way that you can continue to build muscle or maintain muscle without putting your body through as much trauma.

[aaron_straker]: 45:40

Yeah, so I think for me to try and wrap that up, how much does it really matter in the beginning? Maybe not so much. aside from injury prevention, which we both agreed upon as you further invest your time and energy and decide that this whole lifting weight thing is like something that you love, you know, and want to give more of yourself too. I think that that matters will increase, you know, but in the beginning I think this would probably just overwhelm somebody. To be completely honest,

[bryan_boorstein]: 46:10

Yeah, and they wouldn't even know how to do the movements properly like they would be trying to figure out their body. Um, and the way that

[aaron_straker]: 46:16

I was figuring out my body at thirty three years old at the practical and trying to figure how to do the movements properly.

[bryan_boorstein]: 46:23

right right right, So imagine somebody that like has minimal weightlifting experience like one year're in and it's like you're going to do this like movement around your rib cage in the scapular plane and they're like O. What

[aaron_straker]: 46:33

Yeah, yeah,

[bryan_boorstein]: 46:35

know? So Um? so yeah, totally it. Yeah, it, it, it it matters, but the the amount that it matters is dependent on the individual and where you are in your journey.

[aaron_straker]: 46:46

cool. anything you want to add on this one before you wrap up Brian.

[bryan_boorstein]: 46:50

No, this is our last episode Ti the New year. So um, you know, Happy New Year, everybody, and uh, thanks for being with us for the last twelve months.

[aaron_straker]: 47:00

Yeah, I want to kind of to add on. Um, yeah, this is. this is coming up right about a year when we launched the podcast. I think I officially uploaded that first episode like the December twenty eighth or twenty ninth, and it's been uh an incredible year. so just thank you to everyone who who listens who reaches out and tells us they like the show. Or you know, two people last week told me in person that they listened to the show and they liked it and that was super cool and I'm just so thankful for you know that Y that meeting you and I had a year a year ago

[bryan_boorstein]: 47:27

Mhm.

[aaron_straker]: 47:28

and we lifted some weights and we kind of talked about different podcasts And then you know what I'm going to send Brid an email with a little bit of a podcast outline, a little

[bryan_boorstein]: 47:35

Yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 47:35

bit of a game plan and like, hey, what are your thoughts and I'm just so thankful that. I did that thankful

[bryan_boorstein]: 47:41

yeah,

[aaron_straker]: 47:42

that you were like hell. Yeah, let's do this And then it's been just a wild year and I can't wait to to jump into year too, and continue to bring on newer guests and just share with everyone

[bryan_boorstein]: 47:51

Mhm.

[aaron_straker]: 47:52

who listens, some of the you know knowledge that Brian and I have gained over the course of our our lifetime of lifting weight and really just hang out with the every Tuesday dude. It's I love it, so just thank you every want

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:02

Yeah, for shaman. No, I appreciate that, you. Uh that you took the time to

[aaron_straker]: 48:03

thank you, Brian.

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:06

put that together and reach outcause. It was really just kind of like a conceptual conversation. We're going for a walk and we're like. You know what do you want to do next year in your business? Blah, blah, And I like podt. you' like podt. Yeah, I want to do a Po cast too, And and then you sent me that thing and it was like Oh shit like it's It's happening now. and um, so I' I'm glad we get to hang out every twoesday as well.

[aaron_straker]: 48:26

So R I Brian? Have a good Christmas New year? Everyone

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:30

We'll talk.

[aaron_straker]: 48:30

else out there? Oh, would you say

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:33

I said, will talk.

[aaron_straker]: 48:34

Yeah, we talk night later, guys.