Physiological vs. Psychological Signals to Deload | ETP#74

[bryan_boorstein]: 0:29

oh

[aaron_straker]: 0:30

what's up guys happy tuesday welcome back to another episode of

[bryan_boorstein]: 0:33

m

[aaron_straker]: 0:33

train prosper today brian and i are going to dig into a couple over flow questions we had from the prior week's episode a little bit of more in depth discussion around some utility with shortened overload movements and as always some up dates with what is going on with us i think brian is going to kick us off as he usually does with our update

[bryan_boorstein]: 0:53

hm

[aaron_straker]: 0:53

so brian it's off my man

[bryan_boorstein]: 0:56

yeah so since the last episode we did i hit a new low on my diet got down to one eighty three point two which is point four pounds above my lowest low from the prior year on over two pounds below the low from two years ago so i was right there i'm teetering on the edge of that one eighty two range which is kind of what i wanted to see before eating up into the photo shoot and then since that one eighty three point two things kind of imploded so here's kind of the story and the way that things went i hit one eighty three point two everything was cool the next day hit one eighty four point oh just kind of natural fluctuations that night of the one eighty four i was heading to an event with some friends and i knew there was going to be like some beer some beer pang and you know they were going to have it catered by a mexican place there was gonna be deserts all these different things and so i planned on doing what i usually do in these situations and what has worked for me for the twelve weeks leading up to the diet thus far and i was just going to eat you know eight hundred maybe a thousand calories for the day before this event and then that would leave me fifteen hundred calories on the low side to still be like within my range of kind of what i'm going for well i was really hungry all day i literally was probably the hungriest that i've been ever this entire diet so before even going to the party i was at like twenty two hundred calory there's something like that and i was like two hundred grams of protein i had basically eaten like an entire days of food before even heading to this event right and then we got to the event and i i brought a white claw was like i'll have one white claw it's a hundred and seventy calories and i'll just like sip on this throughout the night well that quickly turned into like two white claws and then someone brought the beer punk blow out and before i knew it i'd played six games of beer pong eating the mexican food that they catered with of course i kept it to chicken rice and collie flower so i did okay but but even without the beer i think i probably had you know five hundred calories of food so therefore i'm already above my daily calories for the day and then i had like you know eight beers so um so that happened on friday night and then my weight actually did okay like i kind of pulled it back together and as of yesterday it had gone back down to one eighty four point eight so still kind of above here wanted to be but it's at least like hanging out in like a one pound range i figure you know you dropped some of that glikagin no big deal right then it's kim's birthday yesterday it's monday six twenty kim is is celebrating and i as the supportive husband must celebrate as well of course and i want to it's not it's not like i feel this pressure but but same idea i basically went into the day being like okay i'm goin to eat eight hundred or a thousand calories and then i'll have fifteen hundred calories to eat at dinner with her at night and that was my plan and the literal same thing happened i got i got through the day and like i just kept eating i was so hungry that i was at twenty one hundred calories before we even went out to dinner last night and then i had like steak and a couple o fries and some spinach and a bite of her dessert and a beer and now who knows maybe i'm at like thirty five hundred calories or something like that so in the last like four days i've had two as that just like blew the plan out of the water um emotionally i just i just am lacking commitment i don't want to do it any more it's like a switch was flipped when i hit that one eighty three point two and like all of the hunger that i was able to keep down and all of the emotional restraint that i was able to utilize through last twelve weeks it just i just failed like i just didn't want to do it any more it's the juice isn't worth the squeeze type saying like um if it wasn't for the fact that i have this photo shoot on tuesday next week like a week from today i probably would have already just been like you know it's over it's done by la blah but i feel this sense of commitment to the photo shoot the sense of commitment to the people that have been following my journey on instagram and all of this stuff so i'm not like literally being like funk it like i'm just going to start eating cakes for the next seven is um but i do one hundred percent feel like i am not going to hit my one eighty two goal i mean i hit that one eight three point two so it was like right there on the edge but but at this point i've con accepted that i've had these two big funk ups in the last four days i'm not going to hit one eighty two i still more than likely will do the photo shoot at the exact same weight that i've done it the prior years because i still have a number of pounds to play with in there and i can still eat up i probably don't deserve now five days of eating up i'm probably gonna give myself two or three days of eating up into it maybe do it a a bit more mildly but anyways that's my that's my situation at the moment and i'm like partially disappointed and also like partially relieved to be on here talking to you guys and just kind of coming to terms with everything that's been going through my brain so m that's the state of things nutritionally at the moment

[aaron_straker]: 6:32

do you mind if i if i pin you and and dig into a little bit of this i think it's

[bryan_boorstein]: 6:37

ah

[aaron_straker]: 6:37

a

[bryan_boorstein]: 6:37

of course

[aaron_straker]: 6:37

very

[bryan_boorstein]: 6:37

man

[aaron_straker]: 6:39

it's a very cool sorry i shouldn't say it's cool that's that's kind of a dick headed of me it's a very unique and interesting conversation to have between like two people who who are versed here so i think it's a great kind of use case for the for the listeners so i

[bryan_boorstein]: 6:54

hm

[aaron_straker]: 6:54

have a couple thoughts in rust questions that i wanted to lead into it please correct me if i'm wrong with this third kind of go around with this diet compared to the previous to you were starting at a much closer striking distance this year

[bryan_boorstein]: 7:09

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 7:09

versus the past two so am i correct in that

[bryan_boorstein]: 7:12

yeah about five pounds closer striking distance and the diet was shorter as well oh

[aaron_straker]: 7:18

in terms of shorter was it more aggressive or was it just shorter because you were starting closer to the end goal like if correct me if i'm wrong in in the past two years wasn't the diet wasn't the photo shoot i august time frame

[bryan_boorstein]: 7:32

september yeah so

[aaron_straker]: 7:33

september

[bryan_boorstein]: 7:33

prior years i dieted

[aaron_straker]: 7:35

oh

[bryan_boorstein]: 7:35

from like april the end of april and it took all the way through september so it was a much much more gradual pace like i guess i had to lose seventeen pounds instead of fourteen or thirteen so it was slightly more but but it wasn't just a month longer it was like two months longer so in the past years i had this two weeks diet break re feed period in the middle and this year i didn't have that at all i was just going straight all the way through and i think i mentioned on the prior episodes that i actually hadn't even done any re feeds this whole diet either i had stayed within three hundred calories my calory target on either side every single day for twelve straight weeks not a single re feed day or like you know oop c day or anything like that so i think there was and lay like some emotional pieces to that you know not having a two week period in there where where you can reset it's almost like breaking the diet into like two nine week periods instead of one eighteen week period type thing

[aaron_straker]: 8:39

yeah and that's along

[bryan_boorstein]: 8:41

ah

[aaron_straker]: 8:41

the lines of what i will see with client hell as well it's not so much that the like diet break or the reef will re feeds can really have like physiology gal benefit especially in an acute setting but it's really just like a psychological break from like being so on top of it and then really you get the or you get the psychological get physiological benefits of it to just like your replenishing muscle glycogand you're eating a higher volume of food you get better lepped in signaling like different it does have physiological benefits as well so i just wanted to kind of dig in a little bit and see because if i remembered correctly and it sounds like i did a decent job there the timing was you did take a different approach as opposed to the law the prior two years because you were just didn't have as much to lose

[bryan_boorstein]: 9:30

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 9:30

ah

[bryan_boorstein]: 9:30

and have as much to lose and then i really want to make this a habit going forward to diet more in the spring than the summer because the last two years dieting in the summer was like it was fine the first year because it was covid and like it as the first year of covid and nobody was out doing anything last year was really tough because people were kind of like starting to break free and go do things and have social events and then this year is even or so and so spring time is a much better time to do it because you're still kind of in the miles of winter it's not super nice out people aren't doing all sorts of tons of stuff and then as soon as june hits it's like school that the world opens up everybody's doing stuff so i definitely do want to continue with the idea of doing the diet in the spring instead of in the summer but maybe even things shift like a month earlier now so instead of going late march to late june maybe now it becomes like late february to late may or something like that and then you know the whole diet i've been saying how great it is that i've just taken this linear approach and not done these re feeds or diet breaks or whatever because i really i really like not having to compromise my calories on subsequent days so one of the inherent pieces of doing a re feed day or two is that you have to drop your calories on the other days to account for the re feed and and to me that that that almost makes it harder like it's like oh you get this great day where like things feel semi normal now as a result you have to have like eighteen hundred calories the next day or twenty two hundred calories or whatever it is and for me it's just much easier to be like hey twenty five to twenty seven hundred this is my range i just stay in here and i just and i hit it like a robot each day um so that was good for me i just need to find a way that maybe it's like if i can foresee what what happened here where like maybe i just got a little too aggressive to get down to one eighty three point two because i had been stuck for a week and then i really got aggressive and maybe it was just too much of a dump and then to to all the points that you made to like you know the shorter diet the more focused diet then not having the diet breaks like all of these pieces playing in

[aaron_straker]: 11:51

yeah i just wanted to kind of touch on that quickly because there is like we all have those different types of like personality characteristics that make certain approaches right more cycle logically appropriate or less appropriate and i just wanted to kind of touch on that because i feel like too often people simplify

[bryan_boorstein]: 12:10

oh

[aaron_straker]: 12:11

fat laws and stuff i mean and don't get me wrong it is simple but that doesn't mean it's easy right the x and os are easy where the psychology comes in especially with desires in different food focuses and being able to participate in social things like those are the different

[bryan_boorstein]: 12:27

eh

[aaron_straker]: 12:28

like socio so social aspects that really come into play that people don't talk about as much and that's

[bryan_boorstein]: 12:36

hm

[aaron_straker]: 12:36

going to be something that will really vary you know individual to individual so for you know the other coaches out there listening this is a really important thing to just understand as you have different types clients for sure yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 12:48

yeah cool well i appreciate that conversation before i jump into some other stuff going on with me any updates you want to discuss real quick my

[aaron_straker]: 12:57

yeah i guess the first one i have is i had a really really cool conversation with the every calory counts podcast last week so we didn't talk as much like x is and os of nutri and it was

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:09

ah

[aaron_straker]: 13:09

a lot more of just like the travel life style how i set things up in a little bit more of the background there and it was just a really cool fun conversation to talk about

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:18

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 13:19

some things that are you know obviously these men if parts of my life but i don't talk about as much because we're generally doing exesandos business you know training in nutrition type stuff yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:31

that's cool i love those guys i always enjoy listening to them

[aaron_straker]: 13:35

yeah i can cover a couple more of my updates yeah sure

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:42

sure

[aaron_straker]: 13:42

so

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:42

go for it

[aaron_straker]: 13:43

i wrapped up my neurophase with alex so we ran that for four weeks and now today was my first day of the metabolic and i don't want t say it sucked because that's like kind of negative but like funk

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:56

my

[aaron_straker]: 13:56

i was on fire

[bryan_boorstein]: 13:59

can you can you give us

[aaron_straker]: 14:00

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:00

a brief rundown of

[aaron_straker]: 14:02

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:02

of what you did

[aaron_straker]: 14:04

yeah so today um today was chess supported by lateral pull down right so drag the thing over to the lap pull down and it was five sets of ten with forty seconds rest in between

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:20

like a twenty

[aaron_straker]: 14:20

m

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:20

r m type

[aaron_straker]: 14:21

m

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:21

weight

[aaron_straker]: 14:22

so i tried to use like what woulda been a fifteen r m and i ran like i grabbed on those appsit helps calculate things for you and i couldn't maintain it not for

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:33

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 14:33

a fucking chance in hell that one fell off on pretty hard i shouldn't say pretty hard i think two stacks two weight stacks um to start and then from there we went into a thoracic cable row which i love that set up that's like probably one

[bryan_boorstein]: 14:50

hm

[aaron_straker]: 14:50

of my favorite row movements to do and that when i started much more conservatively and was able to hold that weight through it they went into some weird delt stuff and then biceps so it was kind of cool and that it was a shorter

[bryan_boorstein]: 15:03

oh

[aaron_straker]: 15:03

session i was done in about like fifty fifty five minutes but i mean my arms the back was just completely blown out and i was like yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 15:14

m

[aaron_straker]: 15:14

i'm ready i'm ready to be done here

[bryan_boorstein]: 15:16

it's a different feeling for sure

[aaron_straker]: 15:18

it is but it was cool i really really did enjoy the neuro block though i kind of didn't want to stop because i was like i'm just getting to these numbers that i want to hit you know so it was it its cool that even in like within four weeks that even with the under the you know the consideration that the first week is really just movement discovery wait discovery how quickly things really return so m i did have dead lifts and i haven't dead lifted in man maybe twenty eighteen was the last time i actually did any real dead lifts and if i would have had one more week i like lineally loaded i would have taken like four o five for my last set of five whichwould have been cool because like i mean that's a weight i haven't really pulled in five years at this point

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:08

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 16:08

m

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:09

and

[aaron_straker]: 16:09

and

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:09

with better form too

[aaron_straker]: 16:10

and with better form and what was really interesting like each week even though the load was increasing like my like just they felt better like my last set was moving better each week it was really cool i felt really strong and then my final set of the hack squad had four plates per side and that's like the first time i think i've loaded that much in a hack squat and maybe potentially forever potentially

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:35

do you know what

[aaron_straker]: 16:35

for

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:35

brand

[aaron_straker]: 16:35

the first

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:35

it

[aaron_straker]: 16:35

time

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:36

is

[aaron_straker]: 16:36

it's a watson hack squat

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:38

m

[aaron_straker]: 16:38

so all the equipment here is watson

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:41

okay

[aaron_straker]: 16:41

m which i was actually just talking with alex i do not like and so the watson equipment it's really it's really it's engineered really like beautifully like really clean world and everything is like brushed steel and then the

[bryan_boorstein]: 16:56

oh

[aaron_straker]: 16:56

man this is a good build quality and then you get into it and use it and you're like who the fuck designed these

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:01

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 17:01

angles why are

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:02

uh

[aaron_straker]: 17:02

the angles like this

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:03

uh

[aaron_straker]: 17:04

so like

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:05

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 17:05

i was on the pendulum the pendulum

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:07

cas

[aaron_straker]: 17:07

is so

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:07

hates the pendulum

[aaron_straker]: 17:08

vertical

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:08

i think

[aaron_straker]: 17:09

it's so vertical

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:10

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 17:10

it's like straight up and down almost and you it's like it they built it without understanding the purpose of what you want the machine for you

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:18

for

[aaron_straker]: 17:18

know

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:19

the pendulum for the

[aaron_straker]: 17:20

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:20

ark

[aaron_straker]: 17:20

it doesn't it doesn't it doesn't ark it's just like um and then the thing that's really interesting with with the watson hack squat

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:29

yah

[aaron_straker]: 17:29

is there is a piston in the back and it changes the pitch of the angle you get what

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:35

h

[aaron_straker]: 17:35

i'm saying

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:37

so you can shift up

[aaron_straker]: 17:39

you

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:39

more vertical or lay back more

[aaron_straker]: 17:40

yeah yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:41

okay

[aaron_straker]: 17:42

but there's no like pre set settings it's just an open piston so trying to replicate where you had it last

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:51

oh

[aaron_straker]: 17:51

week to the week before like unless you bring a fucking like

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:55

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 17:55

a ruler in you're

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:56

protractor

[aaron_straker]: 17:56

just like yeah protractor would be exactly a

[bryan_boorstein]: 17:59

uh

[aaron_straker]: 17:59

protractor of to measure your fucking

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:01

ah

[aaron_straker]: 18:02

what's that like your

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:03

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 18:04

your hypotenuse

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:04

the degrees

[aaron_straker]: 18:04

or your

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:05

of angle

[aaron_straker]: 18:05

yeah your a squared

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:06

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 18:06

plus b squared equal c square whatever like you just i'm just like ball parking like this was approximalapproximately at my belly but and this is what i did last week

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:15

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 18:15

um so that's kind of frustrating but i may make the best of it but it is kind of funny because at first sight like man this equipment is beautiful and then you get into it and use it and you're like sucks

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:29

yeah yeah now i've heard the watson stuff is in great i think it's it's english from the

[aaron_straker]: 18:34

it

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:34

u k

[aaron_straker]: 18:34

is yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:37

i also see you did a fifty kilogram press was that a dumb

[aaron_straker]: 18:40

a

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:41

bell press incline

[aaron_straker]: 18:42

yes no that was now i can't remember if it was incline or flat flat press because i was doing both or yeah one one was like forty seven point five the other one is fifty you only have

[bryan_boorstein]: 18:55

okay

[aaron_straker]: 18:55

two and a half pound increment dumb bells you know here and and i decided like week two i'm not converting weights back to pants anymore

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:03

ah

[aaron_straker]: 19:03

i'm

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:03

no

[aaron_straker]: 19:04

just

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:04

i wouldn't do that

[aaron_straker]: 19:05

well because i would because i'm like funk i don't know what this is can i do this you know but then like it kind of starts to mess with your head because you're like oh man this is ninety five pounds this

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:13

oh

[aaron_straker]: 19:13

is supposed to feel like x

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:15

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 19:15

but like when it comes to kill was like i have a ball park around where i am

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:20

oh

[aaron_straker]: 19:20

but i really don't and i never i don't think i would have pushed it that high if i knew what fifty kilos was and then after i looked it up and i was damn that's a good set it that way it's about a hundred in ten pounds

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:31

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 19:31

and it was a true r r of one and i was really really pumped about that for sure especially again

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:36

that's

[aaron_straker]: 19:37

in

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:37

awesome

[aaron_straker]: 19:37

four weeks i don't

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:38

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 19:38

think i've touched that dumb bells in a very very long time probably ten years plus for sure

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:45

yeah i remember when i was in austin doing that photo shoot with you and we were benching the hundreds for

[aaron_straker]: 19:50

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:50

incline and you said that was the heaviest you've

[aaron_straker]: 19:53

oh

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:53

done on that in a long time so to go fifty kegs is hundred ten pounds under and eleven

[aaron_straker]: 19:58

ah

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:58

something like that that

[aaron_straker]: 19:59

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 19:59

that's awesome

[aaron_straker]: 20:00

yea so it

[bryan_boorstein]: 20:01

um

[aaron_straker]: 20:01

does have me kind of excited like potentially in the future i might run like a like a it's something similar like a narrow block but a little bit longer

[bryan_boorstein]: 20:08

hm

[aaron_straker]: 20:08

with the um guys of i give myself eight weeks maybe ten weeks what

[bryan_boorstein]: 20:14

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 20:14

could i do in terms of like loading things a little bit there

[bryan_boorstein]: 20:19

last question on the neuro block when you were doing this was it increasing way each set like you had four sets of six or whatever it was like six six four four type things or was it i kind of like the first set was almost like a warm up or would you consider the first set to still be like a work set was it like you know you went seventy eighty ninety a hundred or was it more like forty sixty eighty a hundred or something like that

[aaron_straker]: 20:42

so fortunately up until forties here the gym has two kilogram increments in weight in dumb bells so they have i could do like a thirty two thirty four thirty six thirty eight or thirty

[bryan_boorstein]: 20:58

m

[aaron_straker]: 20:58

four thirty six thirty eight forty but then after forty it goes by two point five so that's

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:04

m

[aaron_straker]: 21:04

kind of what i would do so like my first six would generally be around like a three r i r m and then i would increase you know two kilogram

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:12

yeah yeah

[aaron_straker]: 21:13

dumb bells and then that next set of six would be about like one to two r r m and then the fours i would push last four i would always try to be like stay with always make it that like one r

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:27

and was it a similar approach with hack to like you'd start with three plates than maybe three and a half then four type

[aaron_straker]: 21:31

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:31

thing

[aaron_straker]: 21:32

yeah you know what i was really doing there was like i would load them about like ten kilos i think um each set so like the first six and then for the second six i added ten kilos then when i went to the four i would add another ten kilos then my second for i would add another ten lo so i would add about like

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:49

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 21:49

forty qetloas over over it

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:51

so that's basically like starting with two and a half plates and then you go three plates then three and a half plates and the you finish with four plates

[aaron_straker]: 21:57

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:57

kind of

[aaron_straker]: 21:57

approximately

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:57

idea

[aaron_straker]: 21:58

around there

[bryan_boorstein]: 21:58

a cool i like that okay cool well i haven't teresting topic this part of my updates which is that this past week on top of all of these nutritional flaws that i had i also did two incredibly large cardioofascular events which i'm sure had some impact on this incredible appetite that i was experiencing but i find this to be interesting topic because with all of the work that the stronger by science guys have been putting out not even their work they've been talking about the work of ponce and stuff but there's a lot of discussion around energy compensation and the way that the stronger by science guys reviewed this was to be to say that it appears that energy compensation occurs quite significantly when you're in a diet when you're in a deficit and may not occur at all when you're in a surplus so basically this means practically for the listener is that like i went on this big ass hike i kind of got lost i was hiking around for six miles and it took me over two hours m who knows how many calories i burned that's kind of a different question but whatever number of calor is i burned say it's a thousand it's likely that i really only burned sixty to seventy per cent of that because i'm in a deficit and that's kind of what the literature is saying for energy compensation so there's this ambiguous like okay i burned sixty to seventy per cent of that but like how do we account for that like we don't even know how many calories i burned much less how much of that was compensated for so when you then are working with your clients aron and how would you like if someone were to do this what sort of adjustments or what sort of signs are you looking for here to determine how many more calories you may or may not eat on that day or the next day as a result of this large card of ascular expenditure

[aaron_straker]: 24:04

yeah so so what i do with my clients is like i don't try and chase acute fluctuations like that because there's so many assumptions you have to make and and what i will generally do is like if you truly did and like this incredible amount of calory sort of thing like we'll see it on the scale either the next morning or the two mornings and

[bryan_boorstein]: 24:23

hm

[aaron_straker]: 24:24

nd so that that's that's one part of it second i will if someone's like ravenous you know and they're like hey i just like i have a client who will end up maybe playing like three pick up games of basketball you know and like a night thing

[bryan_boorstein]: 24:37

hm

[aaron_straker]: 24:37

and we have like a little like unwritten agreement like if you're if you're super starving like when you come home like just mash carbs like go ham on water melon strawberries right if you go over your carbons by fifty whatever like that's perfectly fine

[bryan_boorstein]: 24:50

hm

[aaron_straker]: 24:50

um but really you see it in your averages with weights over the next like three or four days if you're if you have like a big drop you know if let's say you're like a one eighty five if you go down to a one eighty two something that's probably that for

[bryan_boorstein]: 25:03

hm

[aaron_straker]: 25:03

my client all who are in like calory deficits and do do things like that i always instruct them to kind of go over on electrolihte balance type stuff to help bridge the gap of any kind of like like i don't want to like falsely deflated wains because you're just hydrated sort of thing and then that's what i'll do and then if we get like a large uh divergence in hunger irrespective of the consistent feeding framework sort of thing so that's how i

[bryan_boorstein]: 25:37

m

[aaron_straker]: 25:37

handle them

[bryan_boorstein]: 25:39

do you notice things like higher scale readings for a couple of days as a result of inflammation after something like that

[aaron_straker]: 25:48

so that depends the type of thing like if i had i had a client who was we were in a deficit and we went what they wanted to do like mirth and i'm like okay is what we're going to do i'm going to throw basically all carbis on planet earth at you for like forty eight hour period before your weight is going to go up i don't care how many pounds because we're just going to feel you for that and then we just take see what happens on the back and yet you're going to be inflamed sort of thing after like three or four days those things generally dissipate as long as there isn't

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:16

hm

[aaron_straker]: 26:16

like an acute injury or anything like that that's the very that's the nice thing about carbohydrate is the shifts are really very acute and within like

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:26

oh

[aaron_straker]: 26:26

two to three days before and then like two to three days after those you know carbohydrate induced fluctuations are generally returning to base line rather quickly

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:36

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 26:37

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 26:38

that's interesting so about three or four days after i did this hike that was you know two hours and six miles and and all that i then went for my first real mountain bit ing uh adventure in colorado did that on sunday for father's day so two days ago and this may have even been harder than the hike that i did we we piked up twelve hundred foot of vertical to a single track mountain biking trail called bitasso which is a well known one around the boulder area and we did a bunch of single track for a while and all timately i ended up biking a total of two hour two and a half hours um whatever like two hours it took us to get up the mountain it took us like sixteen minutes to get down it was one of those like really amazing experiences that i've actually never had before where you see those well you know on those mountain roads you know biking up and you're like man that looks awful type thing and it is pretty awful and then you get to the top and you know you bike the single track and then you're done and you're just like looking downhill like oh let's fucking go you know and it was like we did the whole thing in sixteen minutes got to the bottom and it was just like this most exhilarating experience but that again going back to my diet and my funk ups i think that that those two cardio vascular events had a huge impact on that appetite that i was experiencing and kind of my inability to control a lot of that and it also made me a bit frustrated part of the impetus for my frustration with the diet right now is that during both of those experiences i found myself like really fading quickly and i had brought protein drinks with me and carbs and you know a quest bar and an apple and stuff like that and so i was stopping constantly and like having and some stuff just that i didn't like go hypoglacemic and basically feel like i was going to pass out and so that's part of again the mindset that i was experiencing i think when i went and ate all that food was like hey like i just felt like ass on these and i don't like this feeling type thing so anyway a whole a whole bunch of things coming together cascade to create what has happened the last four days for me but i guess on the positive side of all of this my strength training my lifting has been phenomenal and i'm sure part of that has to do with the extra calories coming in but i'm you know twelve thirteen weeks into this diet now and i'm still improving on almost everything especially lower body stuff all of my hamstring and quad stuff is pretty much going up every week with same r rs most of my upper body stuff is either staying the same or going up as well especially pulling movements are doing well so um m ultimately like i feel really good about that and and i couldn't be much happier i have three training sessions left in this in this whole cycle and it will be seven microcycles which they're about six days each so it's forty two days of of train without a de load or anything going through my progression wild dieting so i'm really excited to get through these final three days take a extended de load period and i was going to talk a little bit about my next maso cycle but i think we can probably save that for some intros on the following episode

[aaron_straker]: 30:21

yeah we can do that the last kind of thing that i had my i forgot to cover it last week i think last week i released my long awaited body measurements feature for my done for you client checking system that was by far the number one most requested feature and it is out it is

[bryan_boorstein]: 30:41

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 30:41

live if you are someone who purchased it two weeks ago two months ago a year ago right you get at that feature for free please check your email you have emails for me check the the tutorial course it there where you can you can get the updates and stuff like that so please by all means go and grab that and i think that's it dat

[bryan_boorstein]: 31:03

sweet very cool well we have

[aaron_straker]: 31:05

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 31:07

four topics for today that are all kind of all over the place

[aaron_straker]: 31:11

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 31:11

but i think that there's some interesting stuff here so let's just start with the first one and dig in at a little bit um the first one is it's just a brief touch on it's a reminder of some stuff we've we've discussed before but um one of the things that that i've always kind of been big on is the idea that de loads are almost always psychological for me and that there's been rarely if ever a time in my training where i've had two weeks of back to back like decrement in performance to the point where i'd be like oh well i'm clearly like really fatigued i should probably take a de load week now type thing and so i've had a lot of people as i've been going through my microcycle and you know posting everymesocychle other and posting everything on my story i've had a number of people deming me and being like dude you're training past failure on every movement and you haven't de loaded in six weeks seven weeks type thing like how the fuck are you surviving like you're in a deficit and you're going past failure on stuff like what is the deal here you know um and it just kind of got me thinking that like a lot of people probably are a little scared of fatigue like there's there's certainly two ways of looking at it like if you're training like r p where your your goal is literally to accumulate fatigue week to week and you going to add sets and volume until you reach a point where basically you're going to need a de load week if you're taking a different approach to training where that's not your goal like you're not trying to just volume two to force this fatigue on yourself and then have to de load then you really can work within what is recoverable volume for yourself and kind of play with variables along the way and um and continue things a lot longer than you think and so i just wanted to kind of put that message out there and state that i'm not crazy that that i don't have this like amazing ability to recover that other people don't have i just have a good understanding of where my training volume needs are uh i can recover from and that it really is this psychological fatigue piece of like man i just wake up one morning and or a couple mornings and i don't have the same desire to train i don't want to the thought of you know loading six hundred pounds on the hack squad is this impending doom that i don't want to do it doesn't mean that if i had to that i couldn't go in and still do it is just that my desire do so is diminished and therefore you know i need a de load week to mentally recover from that so i just wanted to kind of put that out there get some thoughts from you on that and see if there's anything else to say

[aaron_straker]: 34:03

yeah i mean there was a way you phrased it that i really really liked you don't train in a way to like week over week dramatically i shouldn't say dramatically but like the goal isn't to increase fatigue so that i d load at week week x like i mean

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:21

hm

[aaron_straker]: 34:21

after like with the r p style when you have six hard sets on the hack squat like there is no week seven where i do seven hard sets on the act like

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:30

right

[aaron_straker]: 34:30

that's

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:30

right

[aaron_straker]: 34:30

you're going to fuck and die or you're shoeing those sets in right you're not going it's like a one

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:36

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 34:36

r r sort of thing like you you will overload your c n s to i mean in a pretty substantial degree doing things like that you need to de load when you don't train that you're not accumulating fatigue nearly and this is something that i personally haven't

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:54

oh

[aaron_straker]: 34:54

really expressed my views my personal approaches on it shouldn't

[bryan_boorstein]: 34:57

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 34:58

necessarily say my views as much

[bryan_boorstein]: 35:00

oh

[aaron_straker]: 35:01

because it's in like a minority but i mean we've talked about on the podcastltle before i don't i rarely plan de loads it into my training unless um like someone

[bryan_boorstein]: 35:11

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 35:11

else is doing my training like alex is doing my training when he says de load i'm not going to be like no you

[bryan_boorstein]: 35:16

oh

[aaron_straker]: 35:16

you know i'm going to listen but when i'm doing my own training like i generally train in a way that doesn't i'm not adding volume by sets and then i like to really just run it and see like when i was dieting last year when we were in in salt lake i continued to progress throughout the end of my diet you know and i never reloaded and i felt really really good because i wasn't like ramping things up i was still improving i was adding a set i was still microloading thing and i'm like don't i feel really really good and i think it does there are aspects of your life style that can either help or hinder that right food quality stress managements sleep all these aspects that are impactful that people generally don't talk about it people thinking like silos people man i need a deal o this week not realizing that they're like stress the funk out at work their girl friend left them and there's one where i was gonna use oh and they're sleeping like ship because of the two

[bryan_boorstein]: 36:13

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 36:13

prior things like they're all related is what i'm getting at and when

[bryan_boorstein]: 36:17

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 36:17

you're better at managing the things indirectly influence how you may need or not need a de load it all does come together for sure

[bryan_boorstein]: 36:27

yeah and it's not linear

[aaron_straker]: 36:29

oh

[bryan_boorstein]: 36:30

like this fatigue oftentimes lie so preparedness we've used this word before on the podcast but like your daily preparedness it oscillates so if you come into the gym one day and you don't improve or maybe you even slide backwards one day like it would be a little premature to say oh my gosh woe is me i didn't improve i must need a deloadweek i'm completely over a stretch you know when in reality it could be exactly like you said where something or many things are not in line where they need to be and that if you come back the following week or even in three days and do another session things might might continue to improve and i noticed this in mind as well like there are times where i won't improve for a week maybe i'll even slip back a rep but i won't really worry about it too much i'll just make a note and be like hey lost a p from last week you know is what it is baba come back the next week get that rep back and then the week after that gain another rep so if i would have reloaded at that point i would have reloaded unnecessarily because i was able to continue improving in subsequent weeks after that so um just some stuff to keep in mind and you know it if i'm not to say that that physiological fatigue doesn't exist like if you do find yourself struggling with these factors of preparedness then yeah maybe a de load is is the right the right approach but i think for most people the need to de load is probably more psychological than physical unless you're following a program that's just way above your recovery capacity

[aaron_straker]: 38:03

yep

[bryan_boorstein]: 38:03

cool um sweet well i think this actually plays in a little bit to one of the next things i want to talk about which is this idea of grinding reps and so let's see how how could i insure this a couple months ago maybe it was a year ago at this point lal macdonald and mike from r p had the big debate not debate the debate the back and forth on youtube videos where they are basically just slandering each other online um discussing basically the thought lyle was saying that that mike doesn't actual train to failure because his web speed never slows and then jeff nipper did this big video about how as you're approaching failure wep speed should slow type thing and i would say that the most part i'm in agreement with all of that like if you're truly going to work to failure on a movement you should see that we speed slow as you approach failure but there is something interesting it goes the argument can go a little bit further than that and become a little bit more nuance and so i'm going to use the example of a seated cable row because this is one that i think i can just a lot of people can just kind of grind on i've seen you do it and i've seen bardo do it it's just it's just a movement very conducive to grinding so you're doing this delt row where your elbows are about thirty to forty five degrees from your side you're in a cable position your torso is mostly vertical may be slightly leaned back um and as you row you're just kind of going through you're getting like full rear dealt retraction at the back of your reps but as you fatigue you kind of reach the sticking point at maybe ninety five percent of the range of motion and then you kind of stick and then you go and then the next ones may be ninety per cent but you kind of like grind through it and you're fighting and you kind of make it through and it feels like you can just do this forever like i feel personally that maybe i've been able to grind six to seven eight reps just in that short position you know having grit and pushing through well there's two potential problems that might occur when you're doing excessive level of grinding like that one would be that like a many compensation occurs and for me like i think there are two ways that people do this one would be you're kind of going and then you kind of push your chest forward because it's a way of like changing the angle of how far your elbows get as if you just move your chest forward it's kind of the same effect as if you just moved your elbows back but it's not really actually shortening that rear dealt fully and then the other way this is the way that i more commonly do it is that i tend to drop my elbows so as i'm getting into this rear dealt retraction position my elbow will just drop maybe one or two degrees and it just gives me a little bit more light in there to help get more range of motion at the end of that rap a little of the thoracic lit so either way what's happening there is this a teeny compensation or the secondary effect is that it's just more neurologically fatiguing because you're having to continue to fight and grind through something that you don't want to do almost like an isometric like it's like hey take this board and just push against it as hard as you can i mean that's kind of what's happening when you're trying to grind through these short positions of these movements so when i was on this podcast with cass and dave mccony and able a few days ago i asked cast about this because it had been something that had been on my mind and i'd see a number of other people that follow similar philosophies of training to me not grinding through those positions so then the alternative to not grinding would just be like okay your go through you're doing your rear delt rose and then when you reach that like soft stop where you could kind of grind through it you just don't you just kind of hit that soft stop and then you you release gently go to the the stretched position pull again release gently right and as you pull that soft stop where that soft stop is it gets gradually uh closer to the stretched position each rap so it's almost like you start doing partials where you could grind but you just don't you just kind of that range of motion fall off as it does and it's it's just a very interesting idea because it kind of goes against how i've been conditioned to feel that like you know this we speed should slow significantly as you approach failure and that's where the real benefit is is like fighting through that position and and all of these things but it's kind of made me think of it differently and re framed the way that i look at grinding through some of those reps what do you wat you tink about all that

[aaron_straker]: 43:03

i have i have

[bryan_boorstein]: 43:04

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 43:04

a decent set of thoughts to be completely honest

[bryan_boorstein]: 43:06

okay cool

[aaron_straker]: 43:08

i listen to that right and i mean not not that i think i have very

[bryan_boorstein]: 43:14

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 43:15

valid viewpoint on it but the compensation theory makes perfect sense to me right you are pensating different musculature to help move that weight my the place where i like to play devil's advocate if we're talking large centrally fatiguing movements like an r d l a squat a hack squad those sort of things those ompensations couldn't can potentially lead to like an increased risk of injury i'm pretty sure that's how i hurt my back right grinding

[bryan_boorstein]: 43:47

m

[aaron_straker]: 43:47

through really strict like red els to where like i was you get like that jack hammering almost thing

[bryan_boorstein]: 43:54

hm

[aaron_straker]: 43:54

um m those things i would agree probably don't want to take those compensations the risk of injury is there the neurological fatigue is incredibly high any time i would do one of those sets of an art like that it would demolish me for talking about a rear dealt row i'm not arguing that it's not nero logically fatiguing where the devil's advocate comes in is like but how much neurological fatigue are you really accumulating with compensating maybe a little bit of terry's

[bryan_boorstein]: 44:27

hm

[aaron_straker]: 44:27

thoracic lot on a rear dealt row is that enough to create a tangible effect of diminished performance and maybe a subsequent movement i'm

[bryan_boorstein]: 44:38

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 44:38

not sure with a quarter a hamstring hundred percent with the rear delt

[bryan_boorstein]: 44:42

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 44:43

i just i'm not i don't know is what i'm getting at there

[bryan_boorstein]: 44:47

i think the grinding

[aaron_straker]: 44:49

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 44:50

on those lengthened movements you mentioned like the ardls and the squads and stuff it's kind of like when you grind a rep on that one that's your last like you don't really have another grindy wrap in you after that like it's like you get one grind rap and then you're done so essentially avoiding the grind on a movement like that is like you're at one r i r something you're one to two r r if you're not grinding you know which i think is a completely acceptable way to train like a massively fatiguing length and movement like that the the row is in the other short overload movements though like to your point totally um but also like if we're going to be supernuenced about it and if there's be like these little mini compensations occurring then maybe like you there's a little bit more benefit to just keep the tension on the muscle that you're doing and when your rear dealt can no long or retract on its own then maybe there's just more benefit in lengthening it again and taking it to where it can get to versus trying to force it into a show position that's already fatigued but you know the the neurological fatiguing piece is interesting because i think neurological fatigue also encompasses psychological fatigue right it's kind of like a whole systemic type thing includes all of the different levels fatigue and in the last two weeks since i stopped going through those like large numbers of grindy raps on things like cable spider curls and cable adult rose and the other similar movements like that um it's kind of made me less apprehensive about going into sets because literally okay so so on my rear delt row the week that i grinded i hit a hundred and sixty for or eleven but the last four reps basically were these things that were six second reps like just trying to get get short you know and so you you have like twenty or twenty five seconds where you're just spending grinding where and then the next week when i implemented it i used the same weight instead of getting ten or eleven i think i did seven or eight and then i just let the range emotion fall off and hit four or five partials so i ended up getting twelve or thirteen contractions for the muscle instead of ten or eleven um it's just that these contractions weren't necessarily as short or like hey didn't get as short short overload as what i but the length of the actual rep was much shorter because instead of grinding for six seconds every rep i would just kind of hit and release type thing um so so psychologically was it created more enjoyment out of my training and it made it less fatiguing psychologically going into each set knowing that i didn't have to sit there and spend six seconds per rep to grind for the last four reps type thing so i think there's that component to and ultimately like to put a bow on this one like the way cast kind of described it on the podcast to that i think makes the most sense is like hey if you're getting to a point in your training where you have to even think about should i grind this rep or not and you're already working like to the level of effort that you need in your training so whether you grind one rap or you let your range of emotion fall off for a couple of raps like like you're there you're doing a good job you know

[aaron_straker]: 48:26

and that's what i was going to say is my last piece of it like for a rear delt

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:31

oh

[aaron_straker]: 48:31

ro yeah you might maybe you want to grind a report if you don't want to do that you might probably want to add a few parts els into it just

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:39

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 48:39

to like maximise your effort on a set to like you know if you're trying to like not leave any stones unturned sort of thing but one of the forts one or the other you're goin put an extra additional effort in somewhere

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:53

yep um

[aaron_straker]: 48:55

yeah

[bryan_boorstein]: 48:55

cool well also related to this a little bit another on this podcast with with cast you know we were it was called a com at me bro who is kind of the name of the podcast because cast had proposed to us that that we kind of try to tear him down or you know ask him tough questions or whatever and so one of the questions i proposed was like why short overload movements like like why what is the reason like you invented this movement to press around right and yet people for ages for decades have been doing body building training that didn't do any short overload movements for chest at all they only did dumbbell presses barbell presses and dumb bell flies that was it for chest for decades until cables were invented in stuff so why do we go short like okay why is a press around even that much better that it's worth doing than just taking two cables and doing a cable press where you're still getting some adduction still getting the cable to move across the body you're still short overloading the movement you're just failing to get that last like one or two degrees of adduction across the chest that you would be able to get by doing it single arm that you can't get by doing it double arm and so i proposed this question to him like just why why do we have to do that what is the benefit especially knowing that length and overload movements going to be the profound stimulus for building muscle right and he gave me a couple of answers that i didn't really expect so i have my own kind of thoughts on why i would include short overload movements but the one that he threw out was orthopedic and i thought that was really interesting because the short position of one muscle is the length and position of another which you and i were like all up on after we took the end one thing we were like oh my god the arcs of motion right and yet like in the moment i was kind of like i wasn't focused on that my brain i wasn't thinking about that so when he said like yeah when you do your press around and you shorten the pack you are lengthening the lat the iliac lad or whatever version vary whatever reach of the late is correlating to the region of the chest that's being worked and so orthopetically i didn't really even think about that right like it makes sense if i'm only doing lengthened overloads for one for my chest say but i'm doing shorts for my for my lads then i'm again lengthening the chest by shortening the lot so so it's like all of this there just seems to be a necessity maybe for long sustain ability to train the shortened and the length and positions of each muscle as antagonists um so i thought that that one was super interesting and then he brought up a couple other ones which which i had considered so i'll jump into those real quick to so fatigue management is his one that he brought up and i think this is kind of an obvious one but i didn't i didn't question him on on the spot but i think you could argue then like because he said you know what if you just get more out of doing six sets of this movement instead of having you three sets of that one and i'm like yeah but like what if you know three sets of incline curls was just as good as six sets of spider curls and now you did it in half the amount of time type thing so so the fatigue management one i think is is arguable um and something i may ask him about in the future as well um and then i see you high lighted one as well which was subtle facilitate glucose into the muscle cells and so that was one that i think is somewhat obvious if you understand metabolic training principles but again one that like in the moment as i was speaking with him wasn't in like the forefront of my brain so if you're in a phase of training where shuttling those types of nutrients into your muscle cells is kind of the objective that obviously short overload movements would help facilitate that you can train with increased frequency with short overload movement so you could like i think that's actually a perfect example in my training program now how i have my big quad lengthen day where everything gets really sore but and then if i were to do another quad lengthen day i'd probably have to wait five or six days to do again but i can throw this like short overload leg extension in there after three days and that's fine and it doesn't impact my recovery so so i think there's a huge use of short overload movements there as well and then the last one that cast i think agrees with but wouldn't like come out and state confidently just because of the state of the research right now is regional hypertrophy which is that some parts of the muscle are going to hypertrophy more than others at different points of them movement so there was we believe a leg extension study that was referenced where the the part closer to the knee like the vim grew more at the short position whereas the part distil i believe close the hip grew no it's the other way proximal closer to the hip grew more at the length and position of the leg extension and then cass was saying that in some of the tests that they have done the lab that they've actually seen the similar response in testing the long head of the try sep that there's different parts of the long head that activate when you're in the stretch on overhead versus being in the shortened position overhead so so i think that's another potential aspect or benefit of short overload movement

[aaron_straker]: 54:31

yeah i mean

[bryan_boorstein]: 54:32

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 54:32

it really i think comes down to what are some other context or sorry what is the specific context for like the client the thing you're doing because like the orthopedic is a great one the one that i really highlighted in the most kind of practical scenario i see is client wants fat loss maybe they have some knowgluecoas sensitivity insolent you know sensitivity issues you can use much more short range movements to through metabolic style training to basically um further not influence but yeah influence you know glucose uptake into those larger muscle groups and then if you're training them shortened right you can add a higher volume and then you do a higher frequency with

[bryan_boorstein]: 55:16

m

[aaron_straker]: 55:16

more shortened range so that that can help your fat loss just through burning through more glucose um so i mean yeah really it's it's just the context is it maximising hypertrophy right which is generally what we're talking about you know so that's where one of those things where like what is the context and that really does

[bryan_boorstein]: 55:34

right

[aaron_straker]: 55:34

it is important for for you know what may be the most appropr i answer

[bryan_boorstein]: 55:40

no totally

[aaron_straker]: 55:41

ah

[bryan_boorstein]: 55:41

i agree and that's that's good context that you added as well cool well the last topic here for the day is we had a question on our instagram and from two episodes ago uh about minimum session volume and so we kind of theorized or discussed around the idea that it depends on how close to failure you're working like if you're going to absolute failure of past failure like who's to say one set isn't equivalent to three sets at three r i r right so the literature seems to show that three sets is the minimum may be for in session volume per per muscle but again like just like i said you know what if those three sets are three r r versus one set to zero r plus some partials or whatever and and we kind of theorized that they would be relatively equivalent so maybe isn't actually a minimum session volume it's a minimum session like intensity threshold of sorts so the same guy wrote back and said he had a follow up question and he said as you become more advanced how do you know when the muscle is recovered enough to train it again how do you know you're not waiting too long to hit it again and what signs can you look for and so this is interesting because it also plays into the question of in session volume it's a follow up question of sorts because you did one set even to failure or three sets to three r i r you can probably recover a lot faster and train that muscle again than if you did five sets to zero r i r or ten or twelve sets to three r r type thing so just generally you know whether whichever side of the spectrum you're falling on and however much volume you're doing in your training session what or something that we can look for to to determine whether we should be training that muscle again

[aaron_straker]: 57:35

so the first kind of couple things i had here were more subjective perception type stuff which is general soreness right how sore are you that's a really really easy one um but then also like general fatigue in that muscle so what i would consider this is like

[bryan_boorstein]: 57:51

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 57:52

it's kind of like a grade under soreness like you're not sore but you're you can feel fatigue in them and the other no i had here is i find this is more perceivable in lower body than my upper body

[bryan_boorstein]: 58:04

hm

[aaron_straker]: 58:04

um when i the last time i was like dieting i would find that like my legs wouldn't be sore but like they would just be kind of like little they felt heavier as i would be going up the stairs and i could tell they just weren't recovered sufficiently yet so those are like the kind of two big you know kind of perceivable ones that immediately come to mind for me but to add a little bit more context to this and i think this really lends itself nicely to the conversation we had with some of these other questions is what how intelligently is your training designed right so maybe the prior session was all shortened overload movements you should and early be able to recover quicker from these than if you were doing much more lengthened or maybe lengthened plus a pause at the fully you know in a n e centric position because that's goin more damaging generally will take a little bit longer to recover so that's where you know the the some of it is pure perception type of thing but then also like an understanding training and intelligent training either designing intelligent training yourself or having someone do it for you can really help you understand that there as well so those are kind of like the first three things that come to mind with this question what do you think brian

[bryan_boorstein]: 59:24

yeah i mean you pretty much nailed all of that so i'll just kind of like maybe expand and add a little personal anecdote but but yeah i think soreness and fatigue are going to be the main two characteristic that you're looking for um and i think that soreness isn't always great because you can still have a little bit of soreness but be recovered and so the fatigue one is more the one i would focus on because i think fatigue would insinuate that you're not recovered but being able to acutely assess like hey i'm still too fatigued i don't think i can i can do this today type thing is is a skill that's probably learned over time and something that's home right so i'll provide an example for me in the way my program is structured right now i have my short overload leg extensions on my hamstring day and then i have this other quad day that's basically all lengthened so i did my big lengthened quad day and then i have two full rest days where i train upper body one of the days but two rest days from lower body and then on the third day i come in and i train ham strings and then i am supposed to do my short overload leg extensions all throughout this cycle the whole time i've still had minor soreness by the time i get to ham string day i've still had minor soreness in my quads but i've been fine i've been able to do my warm upsets for leg extensions and and know that i'm going to be okay like i would a warm upset or to increase some weight and be like i got this you know it's fine just in my last session i did my ham strings the other day and i went to warm up my leg extensions and i could tell the same level of minimal soreness that i've had in my quads almost every i'm that i do this but i did my first warm upset and i was like huh that feels a little weird but you know let's take a short break will come back and we'll do another warm upset because usually the second warm upset you kind of can tell whether you just need that first one just to grease the grove do the movement pattern type thing second warm upset i still felt like i just didn't have that pop in my quads that i wanted and it felt like it wasn't contracting fully at the top so i just i just called it today i was like you know what i don't think my quads are actually recovered right now they actually have this kind of received fatigue that you mentioned and and i didn't do them so the next morning i came back and i did them the next morning and i exceeded performance and they felt great and everything was fine and so acute like maybe i would have been okay if i would have done them the day prior to like maybe i could have pushed psychologically through and just done it but going to the next day kind of insured it was like a safety of sorts insured that i would be one hundred per cent recover and i'd be ready to go these things can change over time so for eleven weeks i've been doing this or however long and i've just been hitting my my leg extensions with no big deal this week i didn't feel the same so it changed it wasn't the same as prior weeks i took an extra rest ay and did it again so you just kind of have to look out for signs like that within yourself and then it all kind of circles back to the programming piece that aron mentioned is that like if you're going to have this one big quad day that's super lengthened overloaded then you probably need to have that other day that's just short so that you can manage your fatigue maybe you have a day that's kind of mixed you have some short stuff and some length and stuff so the damage isn't quite as high as it would be if you just had like this big lengthen day so then maybe three or four days later you can just and your legs all over again maybe you're not doing much volume so you're doing like you know one one or two sets of squats one day and then two days later you can do leg extensions and then two days after that you can do pendulum squat and two days after that you can do leg extensions again it really depends how you're organizing your training but i think looking at that factor of a soreness but not putting too much credence in soreness because understanding that you can still perform even if you're light lisa right but that that sense of fatigue is important and then just going through trial and error and probably making sure that you start on the lower side of vallum an effort because if you're if you're going to push the limit of when you can recover then starting slow and being able to add in volume and intensity is as important as you adapt versus the other way you know if you start too high then you're find yourself pulling things out and that can a little bit disconcerting so i would just say you know if you're going to push that limit then do it prudently and you can always just do it on the safe side and not have to push that limit because the end of the day like if you're training quads every five days because you feel safe that you know i'm at least going to be recovered or it's like i'm going to try and design this program that allows me to train them every three or four days yeah you're getting a couple extra quad sessions in over the course of a year or maybe even less over the course of a three month messocycle right so then becomes an opportunity cost of how much is it worth trying to fit an extra quad session in versus just taking an extra rest day

[aaron_straker]: 1:04:58

there we go yeah i mean i agree a hundred percent there it really start on the low end and then you can kind of find where it's going to be that sweet spot for you for sure i feel like and i know this from personal like direct personal experience i would do the complete opposite an air on the high side and crush myself for

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:17

yeah

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:17

a while um and yeah it's raterjust to just start lower and then fine sweet spot instead of thinking that you're super man or that you're special the rules don't apply to you because odds are that they actually do

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:31

yeah totally

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:33

anything

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:33

cool

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:33

else

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:33

well

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:33

from

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:34

i

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:34

you

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:34

think that's it

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:35

on this one brian

[bryan_boorstein]: 1:05:35

now man now that's it dude

[aaron_straker]: 1:05:37

cool as always guys thank you for listening next week we're goin t have a pretty cool episode as we will talk around some different approaches and things that we consider with coaching strategies and that should be a fun one for brian on thanks for listening we'll talk to you next week m